So are we saying this failed yet?
Hey look at that, I was right again…
Hi pipickle, I share your concerns about the value of the Pickle token. Although your posts generally include negative comments, I think they are important in presenting a perspective of a PICKLE/DILL holder facing token value not growing in line with general price appreciation in Defi.
I agree that the increased emissions have significantly impacted the price of Pickle token. However, I think it was safer to bet on increased emissions than to bet on Pickle token going up 3x and providing similar USD denominated farm rewards - there was merit in increasing emissions. There was risk that without increasing emissions Pickle could die (small but still there).
There are 4 more months of high emissions and then they are dropping to 33% of what we have now.
The measures to improve the token value (other than Pickle continuing to be awesome) could be:
- wait for 4 months till emissions reduce - alternatively this could happen earlier but I think this needs to wait till we deploy on Arbitrum, and Optimism and provide generous incentives there.
- implement entry/exit fees on some farms, in particular the ones with low APY like USDC
- advocate for remuneration to include a small proportion of long term vested PICKLE when spending treasury funds (this is already happening)
Hey napa thanks for the comment. I didn’t start out negative tbh. If you check my posts I was very positive in the beginning but the new team’s ideas are just bad. They don’t appear to be data driven. I have yet to see anything that says reduced emissions would have led to protocol death. Pretty much every successful crypto project reduces their emissions over time. They also don’t seem to care that these “DAO votes” are controlled by whales and actually want to placate them. That wasn’t the Pickle that I bought into last year. @BigBrainBriner had better ideas but unfortunately they left.
In terms of the options to improve token value I think that’s where we are at but again the path forward really depends on large voting wallets at this point. Pickle will have to continue to get new buyers because they have already burned a lot of people with the hack and bad tokenomics. Nobody I know will even think about Pickle anymore just looking at the chart and limitless emissions.
I am much more optimistic about Pickle and PICKLE token
What do you think about teaming up together and advocating for things that will increase the value of the PICKLE token?
I support the Pickle core team and I am pleased with their work. I have noticed that in communications they prioritize TVL increase and don’t seem to prioritize PICKLE token value which is OK.
How about we keep sharing ideas on the forum and discord that will focus more on PICKLE token value?
Obviously, these ideas will not be clear improvement ideas. These will be tradeoffs that increase PICKLE value at expense of other stuff and will probably be a bit controversial.
I am optimistic about these, because both of us and the biggest DILL wallets want PICKLE to go up, so if these ideas get a vote, I think the whales might like them.
Below is a rough, unpolished list of ideas that could be discussed. All come with tradeoffs. Just food for thought:
- 0.5% deposit fee for all stable jars - stable jars earn very little on 20% fee and Pickle protocol needs to make money on these jars in some other way
- 0.5% deposit fee for all jars - pickle protocol yields are very high. They al well compensate for the very small deposit fee which for yields reaching thousands % is negligible
- DILL DAO-voted plan to make 30% or 20% of all salaries paid in long term vested PICKLE (using a simple vesting contract). At discretion of the team, this can be waived if contractor work is very specialist and partial PICKLE payment could result in failure to find a contractor. Otherwise, the core team could just say “the DILLDAO has voted this, we can only offer you 80% USD 20% vested PICKLE for your contractor work”. Vesting could be multi-year long. The whales like the $2.5m spending proposal so we will have decent amount of money to spend. If some of this money is used to buy back PICKLE, it’s good for token value.
- sentiment check and signalling that picklers don’t want changes to the 0.3 - 0.1 pickle emission reduction at the end of the year
- looking into CORN buybacks long term, so that down the line it does not become a drag and can’t be gamed
Again, I would like to stress that these would not be obvious improvements. These would trade off something for the increase in PICKLE token value.
I think rather than being negative and critical, we should present constructive propositions with a palatable and politically acceptable rationale behind them.
I like your way of thinking @napa and would totally support discussion of these idea in the SCCOC!
I also think we need to be positive and constructive, team trully wants to develop the protocol as much as they can, and as you said whales have locked their funds for 4 years (an eternity in crypto tbh) so they would support any proposition helping them developes their assets, which mean improving the protocol…we are on the right way! And with the help of every Pickler we definitly will keep on improving
Pipickle, the objective answer to your question is yes, they have failed. The objective was to incentivize TVL on Polygon. Insane APYs on Polygon did not attract enough TVL to be anywhere near generating profit. Cometh USDC/ETH is spending 31x more than it generates in fees which does not seem appropriate.
The “why” is complicated, but partially because the Polygon farms and jars website often does not work correctly due to issues with RPC. Users often come to discord and complain that the page does not load.
Pickle protocol is burning loads of PICKLE to incentivize TVL there but the TVL is not coming. I think the emissions to Polygon should be cut. An easy and quick fix would be to burn 50% of the rewards going to Polygon, before the rewards are assigned to Okex, Arbitrum or Optimism.